Curse

FengShuiBundi · Jul 01, 2005, 09:13 PM // 21:13

Ahh, the great "if you don't like it then leave" mentality. This is about the health of the game.

I point to The Ages' post for further explanation of why this patch isn't as good as it seems. Why would any PvP player in his or her right mind complain that advancing one's character is too easy? Please think before you post. NOBODY who actually convinced Arena Net to go even this far would say it's too easy if the costs were reduced. Don't you remember, this won't affect PvE at all, so our PvE characters are not affected. This is for those who want to play the game for it's great PvP without EVER having to PvE. The Ages' post shows that ANet intended for it like that, but at it's current state, the update still forces one to do a lot of PvE to even get the insane amount of faction required to unlock it all.

Weezer_Blue · Jul 01, 2005, 09:17 PM // 21:17

As for those who say "I like both. What if I want to use my RP characters in PvP. I'll be disadvantaged". You were always at a very large disadvantage. It seems irrational that you should bring this up as an argument against easier, if not non-existant PvP unlocks. Think about it, if you insist on using your RP characters in PvP, you're going to first have to get them through most of the game just to be on par attribute wise, then, of course, you don't have access to every rune you've ever unlocked, nor weapon mods, and your weapons will not touch the perfect PvP only character ones. As for skills, you would still be able to compete if something such as a reduction in faction costs by 10x was implimented, it would just take you longer. But if you are not using a PvP only character, then that is a definate sign that you are not of the no-grind mentallity.

FengShuiBundi · Jul 01, 2005, 09:22 PM // 21:22

Um, agree I guess since you are a PvPer?

[OT] More character slots OR a way to save builds and auto make em when needed[/OT]

Zoolooman · Jul 02, 2005, 07:02 AM // 07:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by Loviatar

pvp person who is complaining

long before this update came out a large number of you were saying

*JUST LET US EARN IT IN PVP WHICH IS FUN FOR US.

I DONT CARE IF IT TAKES LONGER THAN PVE BECAUSE I WILL BE DOING WHAT IS FUN FOR ME*

right

I don't remember saying that. I remember saying, "Let us earn everything in PvP in such a fashion that we'll never have to PvE."

I'd say this implies that PvP should unlock items at a rate comparable to if not faster than PvE's rate.

Spyle · Jul 02, 2005, 12:05 PM // 12:05

Long-term PvE in this game is utter sh1t. All you losers that are trying to play this game pure PvE for more than 1-2 months at most are ruining the game. How many times have you beat the entire game through now? Or if you are PvE trying to unlock everything, why? So you can kill Glint faster? Give me a break!

It's not your fault, it's ANets stupid attempt to make more money by trying to make their PvP game appeal to more people and in the end wasting valuable resources on PvE.

Go play WoW.

Feli · Jul 02, 2005, 12:18 PM // 12:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spyle

blablabla

Trollwarning.

______________

About the spans between things... i seldomly do pvp for some reasons. But the prices are just okay!? Why do you guys have that "i want it all!" attitude? Why exactly do you need ALL the skills in the game? Instead of being happy that you are the PVPers get everything handed to you on a silver spoon, you flame around it is not enough. Have a look at the PVE Side which just got nerfed and nerfed due to the whining of the PVPers. After that, you know you should be happy about that update.

Loviatar · Jul 02, 2005, 02:12 PM // 14:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spyle

It's not your fault, it's ANets stupid attempt to make more money by trying to make their PvP game appeal to more people and in the end wasting valuable resources on PvE.

Go play WoW.

consider it a single player rpg with the benefit of playing online with your friends

it was never called EQ free and only the idiot reviewers jumped on that bandwagon

when i have enjoyed it as much as i want to i will put it aside until the next big update and get the next chapter and enjoy it as well

as for it being a pvp game with a little window dressing just compare the amount of effort split between each and get laughed at

if it is as bad as the extreamests on both sides are yelling sales would have tanked from word of mouth

they havent

while people haggle over this i will go back to enjoying the game

Jaythen Tyradel · Jul 02, 2005, 03:42 PM // 15:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by FengShuiBundi

[OT] save builds and auto make em when needed[/OT]

I like this idea. Make your PVP build, but instead of erasing it completely to "fix" build, but be to save it. And from save, go back to creation screen to adjust attribute points and add/change new runes, weapon upgrades and such.

FengShuiBundi · Jul 02, 2005, 04:39 PM // 16:39

For that OT comment I made:
http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...ad.php?t=27704
That is the thread I started to get people's attention towards it.

gangguard · Jul 02, 2005, 05:29 PM // 17:29

I actually feel the system is good. It's just a little help, don't think it as your main source of "unlocking" Its just there to help you a bit. Although the reward for PvP isn't much, but it makes people want to PvP. Lets say you want a weapon upgrade that makes your weapon Fiery and you spent ages finding the upgrade, or maybe spending ages to get money for it. If you want it badly for your pvp guy then thats another opportunity. Use to be this, you want this upgrade, then you buy or find. Now you can Unlock using PvP earned "currency"
Which this currency is by skill not by sitting around doing nothing and let your teammates get money while you get the share. It's not a thing Arenanet made it so they can win "BEST GAME AWARD", they made it for the gamer's enjoyment.

I dont get why people are whining about this little system or what I call "Opportunity to unlock". Its not a big thing and hey what bad does it do to you?

Envy · Jul 02, 2005, 07:57 PM // 19:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mormegil

Err...no.

Let's assume you have a decent guild, because if you don't, you should find it before whining here. You create an effective build, you call targets and such. You are 8 human players (pretty important pre-requisite). You just go to your little, nice, happy Guild Hall and arrange some matches.
If you win you get at least 200 pts each time, but lets assume you lose. In that case, you'll have to face more and more crappy guilds, which means you will probably win many times. Your rank goes up, a bad bad guild challenges you, your rank drops. You fight with crappy guilds again, you win. Then you lose. Then you win. Repeat.

Try it for like 3 hours, and you'll get around 2k pts that you've earned while having fun and (hopefully) playing in a competitive way while learning something by your losses.

My Guild isn't Uber (ranked 150-200 right now) and I got 2400+ faction points last night, plus almost 2000 tonight playing two hours.

Come on. Stop crying like babies already, please.

I had a decent guild once upon a time. They all have left saying things like; this is a kiddie pvp game, this game is bland with no content, and my favorite "casual my ass". So no I don't have a good guild, and neither does 50% of this community because many of the same reasons. So we have 3-4 of us that plays all the time doing pugs when we can stand the thought of LFG for hours or we do 4 man arenas.

My point was in beta this was a PVP based game and really had very little PVE content unless you wanted to do it. Six -ten hours and we were rolling in pvp handling our own. Now insert release and the degrade of PVP to suit the whining "I want Everquest content crowd" and you have the current state of the game.

I'm glad your in a active full guild Morm but most of us struggle to keep 8 friends online in a guild. When I heard of the release notes I was thinking that finaly this game was going back to casual PVP based but I guess not.

And no Asrial, I am not looking to win a game. Just to keep my previous eight years of mmorpg friends pvping without having to tell them they must first pve for 500 hours to unlock half the crap we need to make a team.

Just like almost all the other expo beta testers that are still lingering here, I want THAT old game back. Seeing the difference in the two games makes me sick of what was one hell of a terrific time.

Mister Pie · Jul 02, 2005, 08:12 PM // 20:12

Seems like a good idea would be to instance RP and PvP characters into separate arenas, so RP characters only fight RP characters and PvP characters only fight PvP characters.

Or, better yet, keep the current system but bring back UAS/R. Accounts who have used UAS/R, however, are instanced into their own separate arenas and only fight other people who have used UAS/R. It seems to me that this would be the best solution, what do you all think?

Though, to be honest, a rather large part of the game is the goal of unlocking that next skill (at least for me). I wonder how long it'll be before people who've used UAS/R start complaining about having nothing to do?

Malchiel · Jul 02, 2005, 08:35 PM // 20:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pitdragon

Of course, but when you get beaten like that the first reaction is usually to come up with a counter to the skill and try it again, which is something that is much easier for someone with the proper skills unlocked to do. Naturally this favors people with more time invested and therefor more skills, as those without the counter skills can't do much other than hope they don't come up against that player again.

Another thing to consider is runes and item mods. They may not make or break a build, but certainly the sword warrior with superior swordsmanship, superior vigor, and superior absorption, coupled with a couple of max weapon mods has an edge over the sword warrior without them.

buill shit. If you got beaten, and you need a different skill, buy just what you need.

It's not like a new build comes up and suddenly all your old builds expired.

I can imagine that due to certain trends, some builds my eventually be phased out, but it's never imeediate. Buying, unlocking 2 - 3 more skills won't hurt you much.

JoDiamonds · Jul 03, 2005, 12:45 AM // 00:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Envy

And no Asrial, I am not looking to win a game. Just to keep my previous eight years of mmorpg friends pvping without having to tell them they must first pve for 500 hours to unlock half the crap we need to make a team.

I'm very seriously soliciting ideas for how to make a fair venue for PvP in GuildWars without merely telling ArenaNet that they need to unlock everything.

http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...ad.php?t=27583

So far, a lot of people are complaining, but other than "Unlock Everything!", I've heard very few ideas for fair and balanced PvP. I'm hoping we can come up with some good ideas for ArenaNet to choose from.

Envy · Jul 03, 2005, 12:51 PM // 12:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by JoDiamonds

I'm very seriously soliciting ideas for how to make a fair venue for PvP in GuildWars without merely telling ArenaNet that they need to unlock everything.

http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...ad.php?t=27583

So far, a lot of people are complaining, but other than "Unlock Everything!", I've heard very few ideas for fair and balanced PvP. I'm hoping we can come up with some good ideas for ArenaNet to choose from.

I didnt mind the prefarming game. Thought it was still a little extreme but it was ALOT easier to unlock everything and stuff was cheap. Why not make non-boss mob zones like snake dance and the boss zones like witmans folley. Tone down some of the missions like elonas, thunderhead, and ring of fire. Not where it's super easy but enough that one idiot in a group doesn't mean a repeat.

Brizi · Jul 03, 2005, 04:03 PM // 16:03

I have gone through the game 3 times. I have unlocked all of the regular skills with 3 different builds, a WAR/MO, a R/E and a N/ME. I relize that this is a GRINDING issue but I had a blast doing it.

Do u have to be a PvP only toon to get to use the points cause that would be a problem to me. If I spent all that time doing missions like the 2 +15 attribute point missions and then had to start another toon to play PvP so I could use the fraction points that I have collected while messing around in PvP that would be crap.

I was just wondering how that worked, cause I havent tried it yet.

But even if that is the case, you can only use 1 elite skill at a time anyways, so why do u need them all. A bunch of the elite skills dont work with my style of play and I never plan on getting them so what is the big deal unless you are one of those people that have to have everthing unlocked to feel accompilished.

I think this is a good upgrade and even if the prices are a little high it just makes it more fun through the challenge. If I ever need something for a toon, then I will get it eventually, not a big deal to me. I am still having a GREAT time with this game and I am not going to let fraction points slow me down.

Also, if you are only in the game for PvP, you are missing alot of cool stuff about this game and I feel sorry that u dont enjoy it. The 2 modes entwine in the whole story and if you know about the history of Tyria, then you will realize what Guild Wars is all about.

Late

rii · Jul 03, 2005, 10:02 PM // 22:02

Wouldnt an easy way to abuse this to be to just get loads of guildies in the team arenas, and pray to get matched up in a deathmatch. If you had a necro with BiP, me.mo with fast cast res, and then a monk healer and a warrior, youd be able to survive through most people (1 anti caster, 1 anti melee, 1 dpser and 1 healer), then when you find a team of your own guild, simply get a vampiric weapon on the necro and start spamming bip. Fast cast res, and maybe have the warriors take it in turn to hack each other.
It takes about 3 secons for a necro to kill himself, and maybe 7 for warrior to die if he went nude. 5/6 second res time you could probably work up a fair bit if you put an afternoon into it.

And thats why its not going to be buffed. If it was anymore, 'faction farming' would be too easy.

xaanix · Jul 04, 2005, 01:25 AM // 01:25

New system is a great improvement imho. Although i'd still prefer UAS, this is a nice compromise, and at least i can advance through pvp, which was not even possible before...

Spartan2 · Jul 04, 2005, 01:48 AM // 01:48

I also like this new system because it allows you to do what you like to do, whether PvE or PvP, and still unlock what you need for your account in the long run. It may not be perfect, but it certainly is a step in the right direction. I'd rather sit back and enjoy the PvP aspect and at the end of the day be able to say, "Ooh, look - a shiny new skill for me to try tomorrow!" than mentally force myself into the psuedo-grind that many PvPers create for themselves.